When I Taught Others, It Exploded: Sifu Edward & Sifu Julliana Armstrong Sit Down With John Thornhill

Adapted from the recorded conversation; the guest's words are verbatim. The questions are reconstructed and voiced by Sifu Edward and Sifu Julliana Armstrong.

🎥 Video podcast coming soon. The complete interview will play here once published. The full conversation is transcribed below, and the audio edition will be available on sifuarmstrong.tv.

In a new Sifu Armstrong interview, the ClickBank Platinum Vendor traces his path from a car-plant production line to a coaching business, and explains the single realization that changed everything.

For years, John Thornhill made a solid living selling eBooks on eBay. Then he taught other people how to do it, and everything changed. The UK-based online educator joined Sifu Edward and Sifu Julliana Armstrong for the latest Warrior Intelligence Series conversation.

Thornhill, a ClickBank Platinum Vendor and creator of the coaching program Partnership To Success, spent fifteen years on a car-plant production line before discovering the eBook trade in the early 2000s. He was doing well selling individual titles for a few dollars each, until he packaged his own method into a $97 course. “When I started to teach others how I was doing it, it exploded,” he said.

That single realization reshaped his entire career. By 2006 he’d quit the factory floor for good. “To be honest, I hated my job,” he said. “I was a human robot... doing the same thing every 90 seconds or so, and I did that for around 15 years.”

Thornhill was candid about the doubters in his life during the early years, friends who assumed he was wasting time at his computer. Looking back now, he’s most proud that success never changed who he is. “Most of my very close friends tell me I’m the same guy,” he said.

His clearest advice for anyone starting out rejects the fantasy of easy money entirely. “I hate to burst your bubble and say it’s not as easy as people make out,” Thornhill said. “It takes hard work and dedication... find someone who is where you want to be and just follow what they tell you.”

That advice found its most famous test case in one of his own students. A paramedic-turned-entrepreneur who told Thornhill, on day one, that he intended to become his best student ever. “I’m going to be your most successful student,” Thornhill recalled him saying. “Just tell me what to do and I will follow it to the letter.” It turned out to be true.

It’s the same multiplier the Armstrongs build into the warrior’s path: a teacher who only performs the craft helps one person at a time, a teacher who hands it on reaches far beyond what they could alone.

In This Conversation

Fifteen years on a car-plant production line before the eBay breakthrough
The moment teaching others “exploded” Thornhill’s business
Staying the same person friends and family always knew
Why Thornhill tells beginners to find a mentor and follow the plan exactly
The student who promised to become his most successful, and did
Where to find Partnership To Success and Thornhill’s blog

The Full Conversation

Sifu Edward Armstrong: I know exactly what it is to be trapped inside a machine that isn't yours. John Thornhill spent fifteen years on a car-plant production line, doing the same motion every ninety seconds (a "human robot," in his words) before he built his own freedom. But the moment I most want our operators to hear is when his own business exploded: not when he figured out how to make money, but when he started teaching others how to do it too.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: And he's one of the most grounded people you'll meet, the naysayer friends, the "I'll show them" fire, the refusal to change who he is even after the success. That's the exact character I look for. I wanted to talk to the man who's still the same guy, just with a little less hair.

Our guest is John Thornhill, one of the UK's leading online educators, a ClickBank Platinum Vendor, and the creator of Partnership To Success, from the Northeast of England. John, great to meet you.

John Thornhill: Hi, thanks for having me. I feel honoured to have been asked to do this, so I'm looking forward to it.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: A little bird tells me it started on eBay. Take us from the factory floor to the breakthrough.

John Thornhill: That is right. I try and keep it short because it's quite important that I tell people this. I started looking to make money online around 2000 and tried some crazy, crazy things. And it was around 2002 I discovered eBay. And I was fascinated by the fact you could take literally anything and sell it and make money. But what got my attention was I saw a lot of people were selling eBooks but not in digital format. They were selling them on a CD-ROM. I don't know if you remember back in the day you would burn files to a CD. And then I basically bought this CD-ROM off someone, it had about 25,000 eBooks on with resale rights. And I paid around 50, $60 for this. Now when it arrived, I thought to myself, "Wow, this person spent around maybe five, $6 to get this to me, including postage. I'm going to do the same."

Because everything had resale rights. So I copied the disc as you do and put it on eBay and for a little while it was doing okay. The problem was lots and lots of people were doing the exact same thing. One thing about eBay is you can see what's selling, you can see what's not selling and you can see how much people make. So I was watching people who were doing okay, but then slowly but surely the earnings were dropping, the prices were dropping. So I had this idea that I would take individually books, so the best ones from the collection and just sell them on their own for anything between $1 and maybe $10. And it flew, it took off. So originally I was literally selling a zip file or sometimes I would send the ebook as an attachment.

That's how I would deliver it. But over the course of around six months, I developed a system where they would spend one or $2 or maybe a little more sometimes. I would deliver the ebook automatically. I would leave feedback automatically, basically everything got automated. And I got to a stage where I was selling around a hundred or 150 eBooks per day. So I was doing okay, I was doing three, $400 gross per day. Now this is what I want to mention. My breakthrough came when I decided to put a course together to show people how to do this. So I would supply everything they needed, I would supply the listing material. I would show them how to automate the process, and I put a product together that sold for $97 and what happened it just took off.

I was selling at least five to 10 copies per day. So I went from doing maybe a couple of hundred dollars per day to sometimes over a thousand dollars in a day. And this is what I want to mention here. I figured a way to make money on eBay and I was doing okay. But when I started to teach others how I was doing it, it exploded. And that was when I realised that people are prepared to pay to learn how to do things (whatever it may be, build a list, get traffic, whatever it may be), and that's when it started to take off. I started off on eBay around 2002, I started doing this around 2004 and by 2005 I was generating much, much more than I was working in a car plant where I used to work. And then I finally plucked up the courage to quit my job which was on June the 3rd, 2006 at 12 noon, I remember like it was yesterday.

To be honest, I hated my job. I was a human robot. If you can picture a production line, especially in a car plant, I was doing the same thing every 90 seconds or so and I did that for around 15 years. And the money was okay, especially for just a manual skilled labour job, but I had to get out and I started to look online. It took me a couple of years of literally trying some crazy, crazy things. I remember buying into this programme which said if you leave your computer switched on you will make money. So I was like, "Oh wow, this sounds good." I paid $20 or something like that. And it was just throwing ads at you and getting you to click links. But for people who have tried things (and believe me I've tried literally everything), it was almost by fluke I discovered eBay. Luckily I stumbled onto someone selling ebooks and that's where it all took off.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: Stop there, because that's the sentence: "When I started to teach others how I was doing it, it exploded." That's the entire theory of our Academy Commanders. A master who only performs the art helps one person at a time. A master who teaches it multiplies himself.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: Stepping away from a steady job must have been terrifying. Everyone fears the online thing won't last. What did that leap actually feel like?

John Thornhill: Yeah. I probably could have quit about a year earlier than I did. Picture this. I'm going and doing a night shift, some 10 and a half hours night shift. And I would sometimes get home and I've earned a month's wages online and I haven't done anything, if you know what I mean, while I've been at work. And I was thinking, "Wow, this is unbelievable, this is taking off. This is big." But still I had a secure job, a steady job, it paid decent money, and it was a big, big step. Because obviously when you go it alone it's down to you.

But I think with what's been happening recently, a lot of people have realised even people who maybe had secure jobs are realising that's maybe not the thing now. I personally don't think there's many secure jobs out there, anyone could lose their job tomorrow. So I actually think I'm in a better position now that it's down to me. I'm in control and I'm not relying on a company telling me I've got a job. I work for myself and I'm in control.

I think it's the freedom it gives you and I'm going to be honest the financial side of it is fantastic as well, but for me it was a freedom to do what I want when I want. Like I said, I would go to work and work 10 and a half hours and my online business had made more money, sometimes a month's wages, and I didn't do anything, everything was automated. All I had to do was provide some support, which eventually I outsourced as well. So then you realise you've got this time freedom as well and I think you've only got so many hours in a day. Do you really want to be spending a third of your life working for someone else? Well, I didn't want to do that and that's why I started looking online and luckily I found a way.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: You've trained thousands from a home base in the Northeast, not a big city. How many people have you actually helped over the years, and does location matter?

John Thornhill: Wow. That is a good question. It will be thousands. Sometimes I go to an event and the amount of people that come up to me and say, "I remember you from the eBay days." I haven't done eBay since 2008, 2009, something like that. The amount of people who tell me it's unbelievable. People come at me and say, "You're the guy who got me started." And I'm like, "Oh my God. I feel humbled." So there's a lot of people who just basically mention eBay and I'm blown away.

There's actually a few entrepreneurs from this area but like I say it's just humble beginnings for me. And wanting to better my life, for me and my family, and that's where it started. But you're talking about offices and things like that. I've got an office. I love working from home, but for me there's a lot of distractions. I did get an office, and I actually thought, "Do I really want to be doing this? I'm sort of putting myself back in that job scenario where I'm going almost to work." Where I am, the complex of offices, most guys are in suits and I turn up sometimes in sweat pants and a t-shirt because I'm going online. I might turn up at 10:00, 11:00 in the morning. Sometimes I'm leaving at 2:00 or 3:00 in the afternoon, they must think, "What does that guy do?" So I did get an office, I've got my son who works for me. I've got a few people who work for me remotely and it works very well.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: If you were starting again today, what's the one thing you'd do differently?

John Thornhill: Oh, that is a good question. I would probably start building a list from day one, building a mailing list. I was probably maybe two, three years into my career and doing okay and I wasn't building that all-important list. And when I did start building a list, I was doing it through my hosting company and it cost a lot of money. Get an AWeber account today, get a GetResponse account today, whatever. If you're in a position now where you want to build an online business, I can't stress the importance of building a list from day one. That's one of the things I regret not doing because I probably sold maybe 10,000 units before I started to think, "Hold on. I need to get people's emails." And so I might've made a little bit of faster progress if I'd done that.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: Most people come to you looking for a magic button. What do you tell them?

John Thornhill: If someone was coming to me saying, "John what do you recommend I do?": first of all, most people who I speak with tell me they've tried everything or they'll say, "I've spent a lot of money." But nine times out of 10, even 99 times out of a hundred, they're looking for something push-button simple. They're looking for that secret thing, the golden goose, whatever you want to call it. And then I usually bring them back down to earth and say, "You're going to have to work hard." And for me it's all about creating your own products and services. Do you know any successful entrepreneur online who doesn't offer some sort of product or service? I can't think of any.

And I think people need to realise that if you can put something together, what can help others, then that's the start. Basically start selling product, start building that customer list and take it from there. But a lot of people, they get caught up in this cycle of buying product after product after product. Maybe trying it for two or three days, giving up, seeing the next big thing coming or the next big launch, buying into that, and they just get caught in a never-ending cycle where they're just spending money and they're not going anywhere.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: When you first started (the computer, the crazy hours) were your friends and family behind you, or were they the "you'll never make it" crowd?

John Thornhill: That's exactly what most of my friends were like. I've still got the same circle of friends I've had for many, many years. But a lot of them were sort of thinking, "What's he doing? He's always on his computer." And it's surprising that over the years a lot of my friends, or my friends' friends, people who've heard about how I'm doing, they'll come to me and say, "What is it you do? Can you help?" But mostly we had the initial, "You're wasting time." But now obviously all my friends realise that I've done the right thing.

And I think that can help spur you on as well. "I'll show them." You get that attitude where you want to prove people wrong and that can help you move forward. To be honest, most of my very close friends tell me I'm the same guy. And I do try to be, I still go out and goof off with them and party with them, whatever you want to call it. Apart from the fact where we maybe got a little bit less hair and we've maybe put on a little bit of weight.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: "I'll show them" is a fuel I know well, and so is staying the same person after you've proven them wrong. The warrior who lets success change who they are has actually lost. You kept yourself. That matters more than the money.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: You're a ClickBank Platinum Vendor now, top 1%. And your most famous student became a phenomenon. Tell us about the platform, and about that student.

John Thornhill: Yeah. I'm a ClickBank Platinum Vendor. When I left eBay I went to ClickBank, and then obviously we've got JVZoo and WarriorPlus. Around the start of 2019 I decided to move most of my business back to ClickBank and within, I think it was four months, I was told I'd already qualified for platinum seller status. I'm basically in the top 1% of ClickBank sellers. For anyone not familiar, it's a place you can put your products on, have affiliates find your products and promote them. But they also take care of things like taxes, paying affiliates. Every Wednesday they pay you like clockwork, I call Wednesday a ClickBank payday. They're a merchant on record, so they take the payment, take their fees, send the money to the affiliate, they collect taxes, VAT, and then you get your cut.

Some of the biggest names, Omar Martin, Lee McIntyre who goes back a long way, I helped him get started online. But Omar Martin is my most successful student. He's done multiple millions online. He literally bought into my first coaching programme in 2008. And the first communication he gave me, he said, "I'm going to be your most successful student. Just tell me what to do and I will follow it to the letter." And I was blown away by that and it turned out to be true. Because I've got my coaching programme and sometimes what I say to my students is, "Just follow my programme because it's step-by-step daily training. Follow it to the letter and then you'll get results." And we have a Facebook group and someone will come in and say, "What if I do this? What if I do that?" And Omar is usually straight in, "Stop. Just follow the programme and you will get results." My coaching programme is called Partnership To Success. It's been running since 2011, and I think we're into maybe the fifth version. It shows you literally how to go from zero to build an online presence, create a product, and everyone can create a product, I don't care what anyone says. A lot of people think, "What can I teach? Why would people want to listen to me?" But I teach all of that. And the thing that I believe makes my programme different is when you come to launch, I help you promote it. I promote it as an affiliate and I let my affiliates know that you've got a launch. We've actually got two launches this week from students who are having their very first launch and it's very, very exciting.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: "Just follow the programme to the letter." That's Omar echoing what every great student eventually understands. You earn the right to improvise only after you've mastered the form exactly as taught. And I love that your model doesn't just teach the operator, it launches them. That's a partnership, not a course.

Sifu Julliana Armstrong: What's your honest advice to someone standing at the very start?

John Thornhill: The biggest advice. Don't look for that easy push-button, make-money-for-doing-nothing riches. We get pushed every single day, we get emails from all these different marketers telling you how easy it is, and I hate to burst your bubble and say it's not as easy as people make out. It takes hard work and dedication, but if you're prepared to put the work in and you follow someone who's done this before (it doesn't have to be me), I would say find a coach, find someone who's been there and done that. And just follow the advice they give, because it took me almost six years to get to the position to quit my job. I didn't have any coaches, didn't have anyone to go to, made so many mistakes. And that's another reason I put my course together, because I made so many mistakes that I can teach people not to make the mistakes I made. So that's the best advice that I can give, prepare to work hard and find someone who is where you want to be and just follow what they tell you.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: What's ahead this year, and where do people find you?

John Thornhill: This year I'm actually going to try and focus on getting my programme out there more. Even though we're in our 11th year, I want to try and help more people. The more I can get my programme out there, the more people will hopefully have results. I'm also working on a website builder with Dave Nicholson. We've created this over the years, a website builder that we use for ourselves, and we've decided to put it together and launch it. That's probably going to be one of the big launches we've got this year. It's super, super simple, very newbie-friendly. To find out more, it's partnershiptosuccess.com. And to find out about me, just johnthornhill.com or search my name, go to my blog. I'm not going to send you to a sales page. You go to my blog, you can check my about-me page and see some of the products I've got on there. And if you want to connect with me, you can.

Sifu Edward Armstrong: John, thank you so much for your time, and for being so generous with the information. It's been great chatting with you.

John Thornhill: Brilliant. Thank you.

Sifu Julliana's closing word: What I'll keep from John is that he's still the same guy: less hair, a little more weight, same heart. He used "I'll show them" as fuel and then refused to let the win change him. That's the quiet victory nobody gives you a trophy for: you climbed the mountain and came back down still yourself. On the mat and off it, that's the win that actually lasts.

Sifu Edward's closing word: John was a human robot on a production line for fifteen years, and he built his freedom one automated ebook at a time. But his business didn't explode until he started teaching. That's the multiplier we build everything on. A master who only fights gets one victory. A master who teaches gets a thousand. Master the form, then hand it on, to the letter, until they've earned the right to make it their own. We don't entertain warriors. We create them.

John Thornhill, one of the UK's leading online educators, ClickBank Platinum Vendor, and creator of Partnership To Success (partnershiptosuccess.com). Blog and more at johnthornhill.com.

ILLUSTRATIVE RESULTS. Any revenue, enrollment, margin or retention figure in this conversation is either a documented result from one of our own operations, a figure the guest reports about their own business, or an illustrative example, never a projection of your results.

Nothing here is financial, legal or tax advice.

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